Comments on: 70. The Crux of the matter. http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/ Discovering what you truly are Thu, 29 Jul 2010 15:43:54 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=abc By: Ronna http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-12011 Ronna Mon, 15 Feb 2010 21:43:42 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-12011 You can find a free copy online by googling the title. As to what you might be missing only you can answer that by investigating what you are. Do it and all will become very clear. All of the podcasts here are saying the same thing, investigate what you really are, only you can do this. You can find a free copy online by googling the title. As to what you might be missing only you can answer that by investigating what you are. Do it and all will become very clear. All of the podcasts here are saying the same thing, investigate what you really are, only you can do this.

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]]> By: Frank Czerwonka http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11985 Frank Czerwonka Sun, 14 Feb 2010 08:54:55 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11985 Ronna, I may not be familiar with the "I AM THAT" which you are referring to and I would be happy to read it if you can show where it can be found. And if you could emphasize the point that you see that I am missing. This way, I will be certain to see what you are pointing to. Thanks Ronna, I may not be familiar with the “I AM THAT” which you are referring to and I would be happy to read it if you can show where it can be found. And if you could emphasize the point that you see that I am missing.

This way, I will be certain to see what you are pointing to.

Thanks

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11983 gilbert Sat, 13 Feb 2010 23:34:40 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11983 It is useless 'getting off' on how clear your favorite 'speaker' is. It is useless comparing one speaker with another. It is useless pretending to be clear. It is useless trying to impress others about how clear you are. I see many who have convinced themselves that they are exceptionally clear, when the fact is their expressions are full of crap - but they don't hear it. They don't see that they are on a mission. Whatever they admire in the particular 'teacher' of their apparent choice may well be the absence of a 'me', pure essence expressing itself. And they themselves believe that they are also free of the 'me' concept. But the me is there in full view, slipping in its agenda. It is kind of spooky, to say the least. Once upon a time, I would have been disturbed by such antics. Now I see it as none of my business. I am not here to save anyone. Most of these seekers have tangled themselves up in the mechanism, which was meant to save them and they are drowning in their own ruminations and efforts. Of all the seekers, there are a few who are genuine. They find what they need, one way or another. There is no shortage of those who are willing to help - but most of these helpers are up to their necks in the same muddy waters of belief in erroneous things. The true essence of what you are can never be offended or harmed. Once you know that, then everything can be useful, even negative expressions. Heaven and Hell are imaginary 'places'. HERE is all there IS. There is no boundary to HERE. It is useless ‘getting off’ on how clear your favorite ‘speaker’ is.
It is useless comparing one speaker with another.
It is useless pretending to be clear.
It is useless trying to impress others about how clear you are.
I see many who have convinced themselves that they are exceptionally clear, when the fact is their expressions are full of crap – but they don’t hear it. They don’t see that they are on a mission.
Whatever they admire in the particular ‘teacher’ of their apparent choice may well be the absence of a ‘me’, pure essence expressing itself. And they themselves believe that they are also free of the ‘me’ concept. But the me is there in full view, slipping in its agenda. It is kind of spooky, to say the least.
Once upon a time, I would have been disturbed by such antics.
Now I see it as none of my business.
I am not here to save anyone. Most of these seekers have tangled themselves up in the mechanism, which was meant to save them and they are drowning in their own ruminations and efforts.
Of all the seekers, there are a few who are genuine. They find what they need, one way or another.
There is no shortage of those who are willing to help – but most of these helpers are up to their necks in the same muddy waters of belief in erroneous things.
The true essence of what you are can never be offended or harmed.
Once you know that, then everything can be useful, even negative expressions.
Heaven and Hell are imaginary ‘places’.
HERE is all there IS.

There is no boundary to HERE.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11982 gilbert Sat, 13 Feb 2010 23:08:27 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11982 How gracious of you Frank. Pity you are just dreaming it all. How can you hold anyone responsible? There is no one there. There is no 'other'. Truth is all inclusive. There is no maintaining some integrity to be 'done'. That concept is imagination about some 'entity'. Spiritual bullshit can be found in abundance on the net. You expose yourself very well. Who is offended by words? Where is this 'truth' you speak of? Has it been divided by any words, profane or sacred? You talk shit - and that is fine. We welcome your input. However, if you want to kick ass, then be prepared, if you can, to get a good smack in the ego, in return. Whatever you thought was beautiful in my previous comment, was probably laced with 'hooks' to expose the believed in 'entity'. You can't trust 'me' - neither the perceived me here or there. There is nothing quite as ugly as a self-righteous prat. I may appear to be just like that myself. Who is the judge? Every avenue needs to be exposed. You have nothing to stand on......and 'you' as a believed in separate entity do not exist. That is beautiful. Isn't it? How gracious of you Frank.
Pity you are just dreaming it all.
How can you hold anyone responsible? There is no one there.
There is no ‘other’.
Truth is all inclusive.
There is no maintaining some integrity to be ‘done’. That concept is imagination about some ‘entity’.
Spiritual bullshit can be found in abundance on the net.
You expose yourself very well.
Who is offended by words?
Where is this ‘truth’ you speak of?
Has it been divided by any words, profane or sacred?
You talk shit – and that is fine.
We welcome your input.
However, if you want to kick ass, then be prepared, if you can, to get a good smack in the ego, in return.
Whatever you thought was beautiful in my previous comment, was probably laced with ‘hooks’ to expose the believed in ‘entity’.
You can’t trust ‘me’ – neither the perceived me here or there.

There is nothing quite as ugly as a self-righteous prat.
I may appear to be just like that myself.
Who is the judge?
Every avenue needs to be exposed.
You have nothing to stand on……and ‘you’ as a believed in separate entity do not exist.
That is beautiful. Isn’t it?

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]]> By: Ronna http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11980 Ronna Sat, 13 Feb 2010 18:55:57 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11980 If you haven´t read I AM THAT then read it, if you have read it then read it again. You are missing what the pointer is pointing to. If you haven´t read I AM THAT then read it, if you have read it then read it again. You are missing what the pointer is pointing to.

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]]> By: Frank Czerwonka http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11975 Frank Czerwonka Sat, 13 Feb 2010 14:01:41 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11975 I didn't come on here to have a pissing contest with you, Gilbert. I am not a seeker of truth, although I am looking for others to explore that truth with, in a real way. I know the truth of who/what I am and I hear you saying the same. What I read of yours, at the bottom, in italics, on February 8, 2010 at 11:22 am, I thought was beautiful. You were sharing the truth of who you were, your experiences and your wishes. I feel that I do the same. I have no issue with that. Yet, when I see someone saying that this is how it is, what it is for others or for everyone, that's where I draw the line and call them out, as I did in the last entry. As I said, unless you are this here, as I am, you do not have the right to say what is true here, however true that may be for you or how non dual you think you are. I will confront anyone, any teacher, including you, Gilbert, and hold them responsible for their abuse of the truth. Then, you just become like those that you spoke about, in your last entry. You have become corrupt, despite how accurate your truth may be. As I see it, you can only speak of what is true for you, there, and nobody else, whether real or appeared. It just becomes rhetoric. You may say that as long as you know who you are, you can say and do as you please, after all it's your reality. Yet, I hold you accountable for your transgressions as I see in this reality, here. I am not missing the point. I know the pointers. I am pointing out where you are missing the point in how you relate them. I see that it is more than just knowing what you are, it is also maintaining an integrity of what you say and do as that truth. I didn’t come on here to have a pissing contest with you, Gilbert.

I am not a seeker of truth, although I am looking for others to explore that truth with, in a real way.

I know the truth of who/what I am and I hear you saying the same. What I read of yours, at the bottom, in italics, on February 8, 2010 at 11:22 am, I thought was beautiful. You were sharing the truth of who you were, your experiences and your wishes.

I feel that I do the same. I have no issue with that.

Yet, when I see someone saying that this is how it is, what it is for others or for everyone, that’s where I draw the line and call them out, as I did in the last entry. As I said, unless you are this here, as I am, you do not have the right to say what is true here, however true that may be for you or how non dual you think you are.

I will confront anyone, any teacher, including you, Gilbert, and hold them responsible for their abuse of the truth. Then, you just become like those that you spoke about, in your last entry. You have become corrupt, despite how accurate your truth may be.

As I see it, you can only speak of what is true for you, there, and nobody else, whether real or appeared. It just becomes rhetoric.

You may say that as long as you know who you are, you can say and do as you please, after all it’s your reality. Yet, I hold you accountable for your transgressions as I see in this reality, here.

I am not missing the point. I know the pointers. I am pointing out where you are missing the point in how you relate them.

I see that it is more than just knowing what you are, it is also maintaining an integrity of what you say and do as that truth.

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]]> By: linda http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11973 linda Fri, 12 Feb 2010 23:20:37 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11973 Hello Frank, It is possible to be conscious of dream and sleep with an unobscured awareness. There is a training, a yogic technique. Hello Frank,
It is possible to be conscious of dream and sleep with an unobscured awareness. There is a training, a yogic technique.

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]]> By: Ronna http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11972 Ronna Fri, 12 Feb 2010 22:53:31 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11972 Frank try not thinking or talking and notice. Frank try not thinking or talking and notice.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11965 gilbert Fri, 12 Feb 2010 13:11:39 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11965 You know what. It gets tedious dealing with all these 'offended' seekers of truth. What is offered is some of the clearest pointing. How anyone could miss what is being pointed out is remarkable. The clear pointing actually 'works' and there have been umpteen examples of it working showing up via emails and Skype calls to me. There is no point in pretending to know. Now, the spiritual scene is full of pretenders and their suffering is not disguised by their shallow facade of belief in some erroneous teaching. The majority of teachers and gurus are not telling things straight. They twist the message to their own purposes. Of course they are not 'doing' anything, as such. Pretending to be liberated must be one of the most ridiculous mind games anyone could play. As if there were someone there playing a game. Some say God is Playing Dice. Some say that this life is a divine hypnosis. It does not matter what anyone says about what this life means. The core issue is do you KNOW what you are? There is no answer to the question - and that is why the intellectuals tie themselves into knots. There is NO becoming in BEING. Becoming is only transient mind stuff. You know what. It gets tedious dealing with all these ‘offended’ seekers of truth. What is offered is some of the clearest pointing.
How anyone could miss what is being pointed out is remarkable.
The clear pointing actually ‘works’ and there have been umpteen examples of it working showing up via emails and Skype calls to me.
There is no point in pretending to know. Now, the spiritual scene is full of pretenders and their suffering is not disguised by their shallow facade of belief in some erroneous teaching.
The majority of teachers and gurus are not telling things straight. They twist the message to their own purposes. Of course they are not ‘doing’ anything, as such.
Pretending to be liberated must be one of the most ridiculous mind games anyone could play. As if there were someone there playing a game. Some say God is Playing Dice. Some say that this life is a divine hypnosis.
It does not matter what anyone says about what this life means.
The core issue is do you KNOW what you are?
There is no answer to the question – and that is why the intellectuals tie themselves into knots.
There is NO becoming in BEING.
Becoming is only transient mind stuff.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11964 gilbert Fri, 12 Feb 2010 08:56:18 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11964 Your Honor, Sir Frank, judge and jury - Thank you for your address to our esteemed members according to your exceptional and apparently limited view. Cast the beam from your own eye...and SEE what is true. There is no duality in Non Duality. Whatever appears, disappears. What you are has never appeared. Any opinions that you believe that you have will all disappear into deep sleep tonight. In deep sleep what can you say in defense of your opinions? One Intelligence Expresses and appears AS everything. The responses happening right now (in you) do not belong to any entity. You could say that the responses are due to 'programing', conditioning in the past. However, all explanations are conceptual. What is, is. What is, is what is. It could NOT be any other way. The conflict you may feel is due to the dualistic tendencies of the mind. The struggle to gain supremacy over<em> what is appearing to happen</em> is a losing battle. The warrior and the believer are fictional. Relax and watch what is going on. Be impartial and take a keen interest. A mechanic must study 'the machine' in order to understand before he can attend to the machine. Tampering in ignorance only stuffs things up. We end up putting oil in the petrol tank and petrol in the oil tank. No wonder things blow up, from time to time. By what authority do I speak? By what authority do you breath? If you IMAGINE that there is some separate authority behind the spontaneous manifestation (the appearance), then you are dreaming. The <em>sleep dream</em> is no different to the <em>waking dream</em>. Knowing that <em>appears</em> to make all the difference. Your Honor, Sir Frank, judge and jury – Thank you for your address to our esteemed members according to your exceptional and apparently limited view.
Cast the beam from your own eye…and SEE what is true.

There is no duality in Non Duality.
Whatever appears, disappears.
What you are has never appeared.
Any opinions that you believe that you have will all disappear into deep sleep tonight.
In deep sleep what can you say in defense of your opinions?
One Intelligence Expresses and appears AS everything.
The responses happening right now (in you) do not belong to any entity.
You could say that the responses are due to ‘programing’, conditioning in the past.
However, all explanations are conceptual. What is, is.
What is, is what is. It could NOT be any other way. The conflict you may feel is due to the dualistic tendencies of the mind.
The struggle to gain supremacy over what is appearing to happen is a losing battle. The warrior and the believer are fictional.
Relax and watch what is going on. Be impartial and take a keen interest. A mechanic must study ‘the machine’ in order to understand before he can attend to the machine.
Tampering in ignorance only stuffs things up.
We end up putting oil in the petrol tank and petrol in the oil tank.
No wonder things blow up, from time to time.
By what authority do I speak? By what authority do you breath?
If you IMAGINE that there is some separate authority behind the spontaneous manifestation (the appearance), then you are dreaming.
The sleep dream is no different to the waking dream.
Knowing that appears to make all the difference.

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]]> By: Frank Czerwonka http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11963 Frank Czerwonka Fri, 12 Feb 2010 02:41:14 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11963 Wow, such evangelistic zeal. I took a pause to take in what was said in response, to see if anything resonated. Even though I see similarities, something still doesn't feel right. I came across a TV evangelist, a while back. When I began inquiring about his interpretations of the Bible and the anomalies I saw, he stopped and said that his whole life was in what he had, and he wasn't willing to risk that to search for a higher truth. At least he was honest. What I mainly get from the responses is that no one seemed to hear what I was saying or bothered to inquire as to what anomalies I picked up. Most seemed like defense and attack, even to the point of saying that some of what I said was a lie. This comes from Gilbert that said in the previous post "‘I’ and ‘you’ are one and the same. There is no separation." ????? Even though you probably won't hear what I am saying hear either, I feel moved to play. So, if there is no separation, are you able to see out of my eyes? Are you able to say what I am saying; have the same feelings, thoughts etc. If not then you are just posturing. Which also indicates that whatever you say is suspect but this is your site and you and do and say whatever you like. Is that right? I went to a talk on non duality by Unmani at Mullumbimby, last Wed, and what I got was that similar all encompassing authority of 'this is the way it is' and she could even make up things to support her claims. I even heard her say that talking about the truth of who I am was the same as talking as the truth of who I am. That didn't help the credibility of non duality teachings or their teachers. Gilbert, where does your authority come from to make such unassailable statements? "The KNOWING that you are has NEVER appeared as a separate ‘thing’. In that knowing ‘others’ appear." and so many others. I can only say what is true here, where I am, and when I make generalisations, I know that I am lying and inflating the truth to make it appear that I know more. I only use the nothing/everything, no separation, as a point of reference as I have no proof as I am not able to be that all, apart from in the head with sense, knowing, feeling or assumption. I can project out and seem to include others, yet, I don't experience the all. And to use the argument of 'the Knowing' borders on the delusional. Without the actual experience, it just stays in the head and becomes spiritual masturbation. What I get from Advaitans is that as long as they know who/what they are, they can say or do anything they want, but no one else can. They/you remind me of born again Christians, their cups so full of their limited knowing that they invent things to prop themselves up. You claim that "The ‘I’ cannot support anything, nothing whatsoever." and then go and make a silly statement like "The Universe moves upon the Emptiness." you tell me how that isn't a statement describing separation. Something moving on something else. I say that everything is one and you say that one appears as everything. What does 'appear' mean to you? Also, "What the mind translates is an expression". How can the mind do anything? You guys misdirect what is actually going on and give life to something where it doesn't belong. I constantly hear you referring to the mind doing things or thoughts doing things. I see that coming from ignorance, misinformation or plain fabrication. And "the appearance of One Essence displaying itself – and it is SELF – AWARE". Where I am, self indicated a separation as in my self, your self, it self. I agree that I need the appearance of separation in order to know and experience. Why can't the ONE ESSENCE, as you call it, be appearing here, as this, and saying, I am here and I see what I look like as this form and as the truth of who I am. You seem to keep identifying 'I' as the personal, yet, I see that and also see that Knowing, Awareness, and whatever else you would like to call it, can say I. You keep posturing as if you know what you are talking about, yet the more you write, the more you expose your limitations, bordering on fraudulence. You keep making contradictions, that may be OK for your doe eyed followers, yet intelligent Knowing finds you out, Gilbert. So, I can understand the allegations against Bob and Randal. That unsubstantiated and inflated authority. I see that words are important as they describe the reality being created with them and so they have to be clear and true as I, the truth as who/what I am, am manifesting as them and that reality. anatta "Frank, “Non conceptual awareness” just means – when thoughts subside, does awareness disappear?" Is this as your knowing or is this what you have been indoctrinated with? Where I am, awareness does disappear, at times. Simple examples. 1. when asleep. I am not aware of being aware or anything else, while asleep; only assumptions when awake. 2. unconsciousness. If I were to hit you on the head hard enough to render you unconscious, would you still be awareness? How would you know? 3. as I settle, or have the knowing of stillness, I can locate a place where there is a blackness so encompassing that I lose awareness and only realize a gap, when I come out. This has the the beyond experience knowing to it. Also, as I see it, with true non-conceptual awareness, there wouldn't be anything, just like that blackness, without a concept, even if that concept appears as non conceptual knowing. So, this site isn't really about "Discovering what you truly are" as much as discovering what you truly are according to our(meaning your) limited view. Wow, such evangelistic zeal.

I took a pause to take in what was said in response, to see if anything resonated. Even though I see similarities, something still doesn’t feel right.

I came across a TV evangelist, a while back. When I began inquiring about his interpretations of the Bible and the anomalies I saw, he stopped and said that his whole life was in what he had, and he wasn’t willing to risk that to search for a higher truth. At least he was honest.

What I mainly get from the responses is that no one seemed to hear what I was saying or bothered to inquire as to what anomalies I picked up. Most seemed like defense and attack, even to the point of saying that some of what I said was a lie.

This comes from Gilbert that said in the previous post “‘I’ and ‘you’ are one and the same. There is no separation.” ?????

Even though you probably won’t hear what I am saying hear either, I feel moved to play.

So, if there is no separation, are you able to see out of my eyes? Are you able to say what I am saying; have the same feelings, thoughts etc. If not then you are just posturing.

Which also indicates that whatever you say is suspect but this is your site and you and do and say whatever you like. Is that right?

I went to a talk on non duality by Unmani at Mullumbimby, last Wed, and what I got was that similar all encompassing authority of ‘this is the way it is’ and she could even make up things to support her claims. I even heard her say that talking about the truth of who I am was the same as talking as the truth of who I am. That didn’t help the credibility of non duality teachings or their teachers.

Gilbert, where does your authority come from to make such unassailable statements? “The KNOWING that you are has NEVER appeared as a separate ‘thing’. In that knowing ‘others’ appear.” and so many others.

I can only say what is true here, where I am, and when I make generalisations, I know that I am lying and inflating the truth to make it appear that I know more. I only use the nothing/everything, no separation, as a point of reference as I have no proof as I am not able to be that all, apart from in the head with sense, knowing, feeling or assumption. I can project out and seem to include others, yet, I don’t experience the all.

And to use the argument of ‘the Knowing’ borders on the delusional. Without the actual experience, it just stays in the head and becomes spiritual masturbation.

What I get from Advaitans is that as long as they know who/what they are, they can say or do anything they want, but no one else can. They/you remind me of born again Christians, their cups so full of their limited knowing that they invent things to prop themselves up.

You claim that “The ‘I’ cannot support anything, nothing whatsoever.” and then go and make a silly statement like “The Universe moves upon the Emptiness.” you tell me how that isn’t a statement describing separation. Something moving on something else.

I say that everything is one and you say that one appears as everything. What does ‘appear’ mean to you?

Also, “What the mind translates is an expression”. How can the mind do anything? You guys misdirect what is actually going on and give life to something where it doesn’t belong. I constantly hear you referring to the mind doing things or thoughts doing things. I see that coming from ignorance, misinformation or plain fabrication.

And “the appearance of One Essence displaying itself – and it is SELF – AWARE”. Where I am, self indicated a separation as in my self, your self, it self. I agree that I need the appearance of separation in order to know and experience. Why can’t the ONE ESSENCE, as you call it, be appearing here, as this, and saying, I am here and I see what I look like as this form and as the truth of who I am. You seem to keep identifying ‘I’ as the personal, yet, I see that and also see that Knowing, Awareness, and whatever else you would like to call it, can say I.

You keep posturing as if you know what you are talking about, yet the more you write, the more you expose your limitations, bordering on fraudulence.

You keep making contradictions, that may be OK for your doe eyed followers, yet intelligent Knowing finds you out, Gilbert. So, I can understand the allegations against Bob and Randal. That unsubstantiated and inflated authority.

I see that words are important as they describe the reality being created with them and so they have to be clear and true as I, the truth as who/what I am, am manifesting as them and that reality.

anatta “Frank, “Non conceptual awareness” just means – when thoughts subside, does awareness disappear?”

Is this as your knowing or is this what you have been indoctrinated with? Where I am, awareness does disappear, at times. Simple examples. 1. when asleep. I am not aware of being aware or anything else, while asleep; only assumptions when awake. 2. unconsciousness. If I were to hit you on the head hard enough to render you unconscious, would you still be awareness? How would you know? 3. as I settle, or have the knowing of stillness, I can locate a place where there is a blackness so encompassing that I lose awareness and only realize a gap, when I come out. This has the the beyond experience knowing to it.

Also, as I see it, with true non-conceptual awareness, there wouldn’t be anything, just like that blackness, without a concept, even if that concept appears as non conceptual knowing.

So, this site isn’t really about “Discovering what you truly are” as much as discovering what you truly are according to our(meaning your) limited view.

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]]> By: Scarfox http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11961 Scarfox Fri, 12 Feb 2010 01:40:30 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11961 Love the mysterious upside down question mark ;) Love the mysterious upside down question mark ;)

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]]> By: fernando http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11960 fernando Fri, 12 Feb 2010 01:07:04 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11960 What's wrong with you? 'Wrong' is a word. It's the polar opposite of 'right'. 'You' is a word, the polar opposite of 'me'. Without words, ¿what's left? What’s wrong with you?
‘Wrong’ is a word. It’s the polar opposite of ‘right’.
‘You’ is a word, the polar opposite of ‘me’.
Without words, ¿what’s left?

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]]> By: Scarfox http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11959 Scarfox Thu, 11 Feb 2010 23:51:29 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11959 Unbelievably I have encountered people on the web who call Bob a false guru and neo-advaitan self styled teacher! They made it a big deal too that he has books for sale. As if 'enlightened people' are all just these guys who live in park benches malnourished. Oh well it is all just mind chatter anyway... their evidence is blogspots and oprah forums. Even about John Wheeler and Randall friend someone said "Both those guys are phoney self styled gurus, who are not realised and just selling books and doing the satsangh tour...more neo advaitin types that's all....selling a mcdonalds kind of instant liberation,,,,there are hundered of them........" and then "Right you are the end...but nobody knows where they are at in the subconscious minds...As they are the minds that cause or don't cause rebirth and liberation they are more important than a non dual conscious mind which will just result in rebirth with a non dual conscious mind... " Which who knows what the hell that means, but good for a laugh perhaps. I'm just amazed that there is anti-bob/randall people existing making arguments. But then again there is a market for chocolate covered cockroaches. Unbelievably I have encountered people on the web who call Bob a false guru and neo-advaitan self styled teacher! They made it a big deal too that he has books for sale. As if ‘enlightened people’ are all just these guys who live in park benches malnourished. Oh well it is all just mind chatter anyway… their evidence is blogspots and oprah forums. Even about John Wheeler and Randall friend someone said “Both those guys are phoney self styled gurus, who are not realised and just selling books and doing the satsangh tour…more neo advaitin types that’s all….selling a mcdonalds kind of instant liberation,,,,there are hundered of them……..” and then

“Right you are the end…but nobody knows where they are at in the subconscious minds…As they are the minds that cause or don’t cause rebirth and liberation they are more important than a non dual conscious mind which will just result in rebirth with a non dual conscious mind… ”

Which who knows what the hell that means, but good for a laugh perhaps. I’m just amazed that there is anti-bob/randall people existing making arguments. But then again there is a market for chocolate covered cockroaches.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11958 gilbert Thu, 11 Feb 2010 19:23:46 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11958 Stand by. New program about to be launched. Stand by. New program about to be launched.

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]]> By: dharmadog http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11957 dharmadog Thu, 11 Feb 2010 18:26:49 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11957 One day someone comes along, taps you on the shoulder and says, "It's not locked!" One day someone comes along, taps you on the shoulder
and says, “It’s not locked!”

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]]> By: Ronna http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11956 Ronna Thu, 11 Feb 2010 17:47:14 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11956 Hey Gilbert, yes Bob has been a huge influence! It´s possible the gratefulness you have for Bob is the same that I have for you and Randall. It was listening to you and Randall that pushed me to investigate what I really am. My gratitude to both of you is immense! Hey Gilbert, yes Bob has been a huge influence! It´s possible the gratefulness you have for Bob is the same that I have for you and Randall. It was listening to you and Randall that pushed me to investigate what I really am. My gratitude to both of you is immense!

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]]> By: IdahoBert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11955 IdahoBert Thu, 11 Feb 2010 17:39:10 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11955 Thank you..... Thank you…..

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]]> By: Marker http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11954 Marker Thu, 11 Feb 2010 14:03:58 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11954 Oops~ Gratitude for the impeccable pointing to that which I can absolutely know I Cannot know… what a relief:) Both apply, I suppose :):):) Oops~ Gratitude for the impeccable pointing to that which I can absolutely know I Cannot know… what a relief:) Both apply, I suppose :) :):)

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]]> By: Marker http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11953 Marker Thu, 11 Feb 2010 14:00:10 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11953 Who is the Guru, after all? He who knows the state in which there is neither the world nor the thought of it, he is the Supreme Teacher. To find him means to reach the state in which imagination is no longer taken for reality, for truth, for what is. He is a realist in the highest sense of the term. He cannot and shall not come to terms with the mind and its delusions. He comes to take you to the real; don't expect him to do anything else. The Guru you have in mind, one who gives you information and instructions, is not the real Guru. The real Guru is he who knows the real, beyond the glamor of appearances. What exists for you does not exist for him. What you take for granted, he denies absolutely. He wants you to see yourself as he sees you. Then you will not need a Guru to obey and follow, for you will obey and follow your own reality. Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj Gratitude for the impeccable pointing to that which I can absolutely know... what a relief:) Who is the Guru, after all? He who knows the state in which there is neither the world nor the thought of it, he is the Supreme Teacher. To find him means to reach the state in which imagination is no longer taken for reality, for truth, for what is. He is a realist in the highest sense of the term. He cannot and shall not come to terms with the mind and its delusions. He comes to take you to the real; don’t expect him to do anything else. The Guru you have in mind, one who gives you information and instructions, is not the real Guru. The real Guru is he who knows the real, beyond the glamor of appearances. What exists for you does not exist for him. What you take for granted, he denies absolutely. He wants you to see yourself as he sees you. Then you will not need a Guru to obey and follow, for you will obey and follow your own reality.

Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj

Gratitude for the impeccable pointing to that which I can absolutely know… what a relief:)

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11952 gilbert Thu, 11 Feb 2010 12:56:05 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11952 The anticipation of the 'seeker' is an obstacle, and you could say it is<strong> the </strong>obstacle to a spontaneous and natural <em>self-realization</em>, which is forever available. Yet no 'self' is there. it is 'self-realizing' (the use of the word 'self' as in 'self-adhesive') This is 'why' the 'pointer' <strong>"Start from the fact that you are already THAT"</strong> is offered. Intelligence offers it - and it cuts through erroneous belief without hinderance. It is only belief in the 'me' that resists. The intelligence 'behind' such pointing is <em>'supremely simple' </em>and it is backed up by what is <strong>TRUE</strong>. (Reality) The belief in being something 'seeking' what it already is, is <em>'supremely stupid' </em>and it is backed up by nothing but belief. The KNOWING that you ARE is not touched by knowledge or belief. This is 'why' a sense of losing 'something', rather than gaining 'something' appears in the experiencing of the spontaneous realization. There is no disturbance in this realization of someone claiming to have gained what it was searching for. It is rather a recognizing that I have always been THAT. Even such expressions as that are not true because 'time past', 'time future' and 'time present' are known, without thinking about it, to be mere concepts. This offering is a non-existent 'key' to a non-existent 'lock'. Stop thinking and be the knowing. The anticipation of the ‘seeker’ is an obstacle, and you could say it is the obstacle to a spontaneous and natural self-realization, which is forever available. Yet no ‘self’ is there. it is ‘self-realizing’ (the use of the word ‘self’ as in ‘self-adhesive’)
This is ‘why’ the ‘pointer’ “Start from the fact that you are already THAT” is offered. Intelligence offers it – and it cuts through erroneous belief without hinderance.
It is only belief in the ‘me’ that resists.
The intelligence ‘behind’ such pointing is ‘supremely simple’ and it is backed up by what is TRUE. (Reality)
The belief in being something ‘seeking’ what it already is, is ‘supremely stupid’ and it is backed up by nothing but belief.
The KNOWING that you ARE is not touched by knowledge or belief.
This is ‘why’ a sense of losing ‘something’, rather than gaining ‘something’ appears in the experiencing of the spontaneous realization.
There is no disturbance in this realization of someone claiming to have gained what it was searching for.
It is rather a recognizing that I have always been THAT.
Even such expressions as that are not true because ‘time past’, ‘time future’ and ‘time present’ are known, without thinking about it, to be mere concepts.
This offering is a non-existent ‘key’ to a non-existent ‘lock’.

Stop thinking and be the knowing.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11951 gilbert Thu, 11 Feb 2010 05:49:54 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11951 Caring and not caring spontaneously appear - but what is it unless we label it? Is there a choice about caring or not caring? Caring and not caring spontaneously appear – but what is it unless we label it?
Is there a choice about caring or not caring?

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]]> By: jenne http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11950 jenne Thu, 11 Feb 2010 03:11:03 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11950 Yes and who was even before Siddharameshwar!? It is so amazing! I guess we could sum it up by saying thank you to the one true being. ;) I totally feel like this is the only thing worth speaking about and sometimes I feel forced to have "meaningless" conversations because if I don't people think I am an arse, (if I ignore them) Is this something that will drop away? Like Who Cares?! a part of "me" still cares...is this only the past conditioning? Yes and who was even before Siddharameshwar!? It is so amazing! I guess we could sum it up by saying thank you to the one true being. ;) I totally feel like this is the only thing worth speaking about and sometimes I feel forced to have “meaningless” conversations because if I don’t people think I am an arse, (if I ignore them) Is this something that will drop away? Like Who Cares?! a part of “me” still cares…is this only the past conditioning?

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11949 gilbert Thu, 11 Feb 2010 02:09:53 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11949 Ronna, you missed the one who is seemingly so central to all this - <strong>Bob</strong>. The branches of a tree cannot be without the trunk. <strong> IF</strong> (Siddharameshwar, Nisargadatta and) <strong>Bob</strong> had not started talking about this 'all those years ago' this site would not be here and hundreds of apparent benefactors would still be searching for themselves. Of course it is all, as I usually put it, <strong>'in the appearance of things'</strong> but if I can use the words <strong>BUT</strong> and <strong>IF</strong> and<strong> I </strong>, and the concepts of <strong>CAN </strong>and <strong>USE</strong>-ING (doer), which I have just expressed, which I will now repeat. If I can use the words...etc....as if there is someone here that could DO that - by simply being aware of what is appearing to happen, the energy of belief dwindles to nothing. A relaxation into the spontaneous nature of being with what is 'happens'. And I will now be quiet. A how absurd to even believe that I could be quiet. So amusing to watch. Since it is impossible to transmit what is so obvious - laughing spontaneously bubbles up out of nowhere. P.S. Some 'teachers' make a fuss about having been commanded by their Guru to speak or teach. It sounds so fake when I hear that. When asked about whether that had happened for Bob his answer, as I remember it was - "Even if he had told me not to speak, it would have made no difference". Talking happens - and if I can add, <strong>what else</strong> is there <strong>worth</strong> talking about? Ronna, you missed the one who is seemingly so central to all this – Bob. The branches of a tree cannot be without the trunk. IF (Siddharameshwar, Nisargadatta and) Bob had not started talking about this ‘all those years ago’ this site would not be here and hundreds of apparent benefactors would still be searching for themselves. Of course it is all, as I usually put it, ‘in the appearance of things’ but if I can use the words BUT and IF and I , and the concepts of CAN and USE-ING (doer), which I have just expressed, which I will now repeat. If I can use the words…etc….as if there is someone here that could DO that – by simply being aware of what is appearing to happen, the energy of belief dwindles to nothing. A relaxation into the spontaneous nature of being with what is ‘happens’.
And I will now be quiet. A how absurd to even believe that I could be quiet. So amusing to watch.
Since it is impossible to transmit what is so obvious – laughing spontaneously bubbles up out of nowhere.
P.S. Some ‘teachers’ make a fuss about having been commanded by their Guru to speak or teach. It sounds so fake when I hear that.
When asked about whether that had happened for Bob his answer, as I remember it was – “Even if he had told me not to speak, it would have made no difference”. Talking happens – and if I can add, what else is there worth talking about?

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]]> By: fernando http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11948 fernando Thu, 11 Feb 2010 01:29:08 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11948 The content of me-thought is ‘story’, fiction, imagination. ALL of it. It doesn’t matter at all. What you are is NOT a ‘story’. You are NOT imagination. But indisputably you ARE (and you KNOW you are). Being what you ALREADY are is enough. The content of me-thought is ‘story’, fiction, imagination. ALL of it.
It doesn’t matter at all.
What you are is NOT a ‘story’. You are NOT imagination.
But indisputably you ARE (and you KNOW you are).

Being what you ALREADY are is enough.

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]]> By: Ronna http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11947 Ronna Wed, 10 Feb 2010 19:48:10 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11947 Sharing this is a difficult task at times. Relaxing into the flow of conversation, just being as the thoughts, ideas etc are occurring seems to work well in the experiences I am having with sharing this unspeakable truth. I love the moment of recognition over and over again!! I am incredibly grateful that this website continues to offer anyone the challenge to investigate who they really are. There is so much information here that it seems impossible to me why anyone would not do this investigation. Thanks Gilbert, Areti, Randall and everyone else for all the time, money and effort you have all donated to making is so clear for so many!!! Sharing this is a difficult task at times. Relaxing into the flow of conversation, just being as the thoughts, ideas etc are occurring seems to work well in the experiences I am having with sharing this unspeakable truth. I love the moment of recognition over and over again!! I am incredibly grateful that this website continues to offer anyone the challenge to investigate who they really are. There is so much information here that it seems impossible to me why anyone would not do this investigation. Thanks Gilbert, Areti, Randall and everyone else for all the time, money and effort you have all donated to making is so clear for so many!!!

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]]> By: Cheryl http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11946 Cheryl Wed, 10 Feb 2010 19:39:44 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11946 One essence expressing as everything...in Vancouver, BC, in the midst of winter flowers and sprouts are appearing everywhere. Intelligence knows. At any rate is has screwed with the Olympics.:) One essence expressing as everything…in Vancouver, BC, in the midst of winter flowers and sprouts are appearing everywhere. Intelligence knows. At any rate is has screwed with the Olympics.:)

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]]> By: claudia http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11945 claudia Wed, 10 Feb 2010 06:03:10 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11945 Oh Gilbert, I don't know what would be of 'me' if I wouldn't have come across what's so insistently pointed out here, if this message wouldn't have resonated so loudly, and the urge to know my true nature so strong... I almost miss those intense days of desperate seeking, wanting so badly to know, hahaha.... And then the huge relief: I CANNOT know what I am, I AM the knowing! How could I NOT BE THAT? There is no separation, the knower, knowing and the known are one. It is so obvious that it is ridiculous! Now, when ever I try to share this, I mostly get harsh rejections, just like in your own experience. Some people even get very very upset, haha, it is amazing... Oh Gilbert, I don’t know what would be of ‘me’ if I wouldn’t have come across what’s so insistently pointed out here, if this message wouldn’t have resonated so loudly, and the urge to know my true nature so strong… I almost miss those intense days of desperate seeking, wanting so badly to know, hahaha…. And then the huge relief: I CANNOT know what I am, I AM the knowing! How could I NOT BE THAT? There is no separation, the knower, knowing and the known are one. It is so obvious that it is ridiculous!

Now, when ever I try to share this, I mostly get harsh rejections, just like in your own experience. Some people even get very very upset, haha, it is amazing…

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11944 gilbert Wed, 10 Feb 2010 01:37:02 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11944 Have you benefited from hearing the message? Does life flow a little more smoothly these days? The old 'catches' and 'hooks' have lost their sharp edges? Do you share the good news with your friends? The UGC has grown considerably in two short years. However, it has the potential to 'touch' many more. Tell a friend today. Who knows what may come of it? Seekers are self-centered 'creatures'. When the seeking vanishes, there is a natural willingness to share, to share in a simple way. Thank you for your participation. When you help another, you help yourself. Have you benefited from hearing the message? Does life flow a little more smoothly these days? The old ‘catches’ and ‘hooks’ have lost their sharp edges?
Do you share the good news with your friends?
The UGC has grown considerably in two short years. However, it has the potential to ‘touch’ many more. Tell a friend today. Who knows what may come of it?
Seekers are self-centered ‘creatures’. When the seeking vanishes, there is a natural willingness to share, to share in a simple way.
Thank you for your participation. When you help another, you help yourself.

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]]> By: suki http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11943 suki Tue, 09 Feb 2010 19:03:17 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11943 You appear as everything. Everything appears in You. Yet, You have never appeared. You, the non-dual indivisible reality cannot become two. You appear as everything.

Everything appears in You.

Yet, You have never appeared.

You, the non-dual indivisible reality cannot become two.

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]]> By: fernando http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11942 fernando Tue, 09 Feb 2010 18:23:08 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11942 What we call ‘reality’ (thought, sensation and perception) IS. It IS because I AM. There’s nothing outside this IS-ness you ARE. YOU appear AS everything. What we call ‘reality’ (thought, sensation and perception) IS.
It IS because I AM.
There’s nothing outside this IS-ness you ARE.
YOU appear AS everything.

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]]> By: anatta http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11941 anatta Tue, 09 Feb 2010 15:29:25 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11941 Hehe, I said "hampster"! Hehe, I said “hampster”!

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]]> By: anatta http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11940 anatta Tue, 09 Feb 2010 15:27:54 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11940 "Mind"/thoughts, appear within knowing as do all "things". You don't need a friend to tell you about it because "you" wouldn't know you had a friend without it. No "you", friend, thoughts or any other thing would appear. The subject/object duality (as all conceptual divisions) is false. There isn't knowing on one side and the known on the other - all there is is knowing/awareness/whatever you want to call it and ALL appearances are only a movement within this. Thoughts may arise describing a "me" that has or doesn't have this but these thoughts can only appear in knowing - the image is secondary and irrelevant. The ego image usually carries with it a desire to be special and in eternal bliss but knowing is absolutely ordinary and timeless and the self image is a temporary appearance, bound to fade. No special knowledge or attainment is needed to be what you are, in fact, it's IMPOSSIBLE to not be what you are, regardless of thought stories that say otherwise. It isn't that there is a special moment when one says "Aha! I got it!" but it is realizing that it is all that has ever been, even in the appearance of sadness and suffering. Consciousness = awareness of contrast so, as long as consciousness is present light/dark, heat/cold, pleasure/pain, happiness/sadness will appear. The image of enlightenment equalling eternal happiness is bullshit and this is what keeps one on the hampster wheel of seeking. “Mind”/thoughts, appear within knowing as do all “things”. You don’t need a friend to tell you about it because “you” wouldn’t know you had a friend without it. No “you”, friend, thoughts or any other thing would appear.

The subject/object duality (as all conceptual divisions) is false. There isn’t knowing on one side and the known on the other – all there is is knowing/awareness/whatever you want to call it and ALL appearances are only a movement within this.

Thoughts may arise describing a “me” that has or doesn’t have this but these thoughts can only appear in knowing – the image is secondary and irrelevant.

The ego image usually carries with it a desire to be special and in eternal bliss but knowing is absolutely ordinary and timeless and the self image is a temporary appearance, bound to fade. No special knowledge or attainment is needed to be what you are, in fact, it’s IMPOSSIBLE to not be what you are, regardless of thought stories that say otherwise.

It isn’t that there is a special moment when one says “Aha! I got it!” but it is realizing that it is all that has ever been, even in the appearance of sadness and suffering. Consciousness = awareness of contrast so, as long as consciousness is present light/dark, heat/cold, pleasure/pain, happiness/sadness will appear. The image of enlightenment equalling eternal happiness is bullshit and this is what keeps one on the hampster wheel of seeking.

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]]> By: Cheryl http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11939 Cheryl Tue, 09 Feb 2010 02:19:23 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11939 G: "Knowing that you are not separate is not a concept that is believed in. It is spontaneous knowing...It already is, all efforts to acquire it fail." According to my friend this spontaneous knowing is better than anything the mind can come up with. Mind in relative terms is small and limited. As hard as it tries (and believe me it tries) mind will never figure it out. This is priceless information. G: “Knowing that you are not separate is not a concept that is believed in. It is spontaneous knowing…It already is, all efforts to acquire it fail.”

According to my friend this spontaneous knowing is better than anything the mind can come up with. Mind in relative terms is small and limited. As hard as it tries (and believe me it tries) mind will never figure it out.

This is priceless information.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11938 gilbert Tue, 09 Feb 2010 02:08:44 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11938 Everything continues on just the same. There is no life changing 'event' called 'enlightenment'. All experiences come and go. What is being pointed at does not come and go. It is not some mysterious 'something' that one miraculously acquires from some practice or methodology. It is already present AS presence-awareness. Everything continues just the same - except psychological suffering has no place to lodge itself. Even though the thoughts of "How can anyone listen to these programs and not see what is being pointed out?" appear, they also disappear without a trace of concern. Who cares? Yet what is being pointed out is truly a wonder of wonders. The fact of your own existence....what a miracle. It may appear as a Big Deal for a few moments but it relaxes into ordinary awareness - which is what it is. Non-conceptual, naked awareness. Free of any fabricated support from 'memory' or of the 'mind'. Everything continues on just the same. There is no life changing ‘event’ called ‘enlightenment’. All experiences come and go.
What is being pointed at does not come and go. It is not some mysterious ‘something’ that one miraculously acquires from some practice or methodology. It is already present AS presence-awareness.
Everything continues just the same – except psychological suffering has no place to lodge itself.
Even though the thoughts of “How can anyone listen to these programs and not see what is being pointed out?” appear, they also disappear without a trace of concern.
Who cares?
Yet what is being pointed out is truly a wonder of wonders.
The fact of your own existence….what a miracle.
It may appear as a Big Deal for a few moments but it relaxes into ordinary awareness – which is what it is. Non-conceptual, naked awareness. Free of any fabricated support from ‘memory’ or of the ‘mind’.

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]]> By: anatta http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11937 anatta Tue, 09 Feb 2010 01:21:34 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11937 Frank, "Non conceptual awareness" just means - when thoughts subside, does awareness disappear? No, there must be awareness for thoughts or anything else to appear. This can't be lost or escaped. There is noone that has this and someone else who doesn't. It is the essence of all experience. Frank, “Non conceptual awareness” just means – when thoughts subside, does awareness disappear? No, there must be awareness for thoughts or anything else to appear. This can’t be lost or escaped. There is noone that has this and someone else who doesn’t. It is the essence of all experience.

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]]> By: mark http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11936 mark Mon, 08 Feb 2010 21:59:36 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11936 'Everybody's talkin' at me I don't hear a word they're saying Only the echoes of my mind' For Frank ‘Everybody’s talkin’ at me I don’t hear a word they’re saying Only the echoes of my mind’ For Frank

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11935 gilbert Mon, 08 Feb 2010 03:29:57 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11935 Quote from above: "You do appear to be speaking to others". The KNOWING that you are has NEVER appeared as a separate 'thing'. In that knowing 'others' appear. Speaking appears. In taking yourself to be separate, there is no real communication possible, only <em>apparent </em>communication. Knowing that you are not separate is not a concept that is believed in. It is spontaneous knowing. This knowing is not the result of some sadana or practice, nothing is actually cultivated. It already IS. All efforts to acquire it fail. The 'entity' that tries fails - all its seeming progress is only an appearance in BEING. BEING is beyond success and failure. It IS....BE-ING. Presence-awareness. Quote from above: "I support Non Duality". The 'I' cannot support anything, nothing whatsoever. Even if you assign the 'I' as being everything it is all nothing but 'appearance', a movement in and on Emptiness. The Universe moves upon the Emptiness. Innately it is known and it is obvious. What the mind translates is an expression, valid, just as any other appearance is valid. Quote from above: "Everything is one" - this is a confusing statement and it is not true. The correction is: ONE appears AS everything. The integration and disintegration of all forms, all patterns in<em> 'time and space'</em>, duration and volume, are simply the appearance of One Essence <strong>displaying itself</strong> - <strong>and it is SELF - AWARE</strong>. <em> (It does not need a 'you' or 'I' to BE what it IS.)</em> The basic (non) thing is, that nothing has any separate or independent nature apart from this pure cognition (knowing). Some call it Nirvana, some call it 'enlightenment' or 'buddha-hood', Some call it 'christ-hood'. Whatever you call it does not matter. It is THAT which you cannot negate. In trying to negate it, all beliefs fall away - and leave you present and aware, as you always have been. Nowhere to go, nothing to get. Welcome back. Quote from above: “You do appear to be speaking to others”.

The KNOWING that you are has NEVER appeared as a separate ‘thing’. In that knowing ‘others’ appear. Speaking appears.
In taking yourself to be separate, there is no real communication possible, only apparent communication.
Knowing that you are not separate is not a concept that is believed in.
It is spontaneous knowing. This knowing is not the result of some sadana or practice, nothing is actually cultivated.
It already IS. All efforts to acquire it fail. The ‘entity’ that tries fails – all its seeming progress is only an appearance in BEING.
BEING is beyond success and failure. It IS….BE-ING. Presence-awareness.

Quote from above: “I support Non Duality”. The ‘I’ cannot support anything, nothing whatsoever. Even if you assign the ‘I’ as being everything it is all nothing but ‘appearance’, a movement in and on Emptiness. The Universe moves upon the Emptiness.
Innately it is known and it is obvious.
What the mind translates is an expression, valid, just as any other appearance is valid.
Quote from above: “Everything is one” – this is a confusing statement and it is not true.
The correction is: ONE appears AS everything.
The integration and disintegration of all forms, all patterns in ‘time and space’, duration and volume, are simply the appearance of One Essence displaying itself – and it is SELF – AWARE. (It does not need a ‘you’ or ‘I’ to BE what it IS.)
The basic (non) thing is, that nothing has any separate or independent nature apart from this pure cognition (knowing).
Some call it Nirvana, some call it ‘enlightenment’ or ‘buddha-hood’, Some call it ‘christ-hood’.
Whatever you call it does not matter.
It is THAT which you cannot negate.
In trying to negate it, all beliefs fall away – and leave you present and aware, as you always have been.
Nowhere to go, nothing to get.
Welcome back.

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]]> By: Randall Friend http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11934 Randall Friend Mon, 08 Feb 2010 03:09:24 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11934 The primary split is subject-object - taking reality to be made up of "things" and then a subject is there, apart, to witness or know these things. That witness is just then one of those separate things. By definition, a thing is separate and implies other things. So that "I"-concept is the product of this initial - false - split. That split must be already assumed and solidified as beyond question to arrive at a subject-"I" who SEES an object. The invitation is to question the split itself, instead of seeking based on the assumption that the split is actual. IS reality split? We say there is experience - objects, and a subject or experiencer. This equation is not actual reality. And it's not something which is arrived at through years of seeking - that very seeking is an assumption of that split, yes? So the experience, the sensation or perception, and the experiencing of the sensation or perception - are these two independent "things" or states or realities? Is experiencing apart FROM experience? Have a look. Question that primary split - subject-object - before then asking questions about an entity - a "me" - which requires that split to be reality. Question the root itself. Without a split of reality into seer and seen, there is only the "seeing" - only the present nondual reality. Only what-IS. The primary split is subject-object – taking reality to be made up of “things” and then a subject is there, apart, to witness or know these things. That witness is just then one of those separate things. By definition, a thing is separate and implies other things.

So that “I”-concept is the product of this initial – false – split. That split must be already assumed and solidified as beyond question to arrive at a subject-”I” who SEES an object.

The invitation is to question the split itself, instead of seeking based on the assumption that the split is actual. IS reality split?

We say there is experience – objects, and a subject or experiencer. This equation is not actual reality. And it’s not something which is arrived at through years of seeking – that very seeking is an assumption of that split, yes?

So the experience, the sensation or perception, and the experiencing of the sensation or perception – are these two independent “things” or states or realities? Is experiencing apart FROM experience? Have a look.

Question that primary split – subject-object – before then asking questions about an entity – a “me” – which requires that split to be reality. Question the root itself.

Without a split of reality into seer and seen, there is only the “seeing” – only the present nondual reality. Only what-IS.

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]]> By: Frank Czerwonka http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11933 Frank Czerwonka Mon, 08 Feb 2010 03:07:36 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11933 I enjoy the quirkiness of what you guys are doing here on this site. Playful, yet meaningful. And you seem to function on various levels. - “Discovering what you truly are", which leaves things open. - Then particularly on the subject of Non Duality and I take that to mean that there is no separation; that all is one and this is a specific focus. - And on this podcast, “all pointers are pointing at non conceptual awareness.” As a specific aspect of non duality or is it the only aspect of non duality? Even though I support Non Duality and see the importance of finding out the truth of who I am and nurturing that, I see that non conceptual awareness is only part of the story and I pick up anomalies from what these speakers are saying. I would like to ask the speakers or anyone else, “Describe how you relate, speak or converse, with another, as the truth of who you say you are, as non conceptual awareness?” I am making the assumption that there are others, and not just figments of the imagination of the ‘one’, because you do appear to be speaking to others. I enjoy the quirkiness of what you guys are doing here on this site. Playful, yet meaningful.

And you seem to function on various levels.
- “Discovering what you truly are”, which leaves things open.
- Then particularly on the subject of Non Duality and I take that to mean that there is no separation; that all is one and this is a specific focus.
- And on this podcast, “all pointers are pointing at non conceptual awareness.” As a specific aspect of non duality or is it the only aspect of non duality?

Even though I support Non Duality and see the importance of finding out the truth of who I am and nurturing that, I see that non conceptual awareness is only part of the story and I pick up anomalies from what these speakers are saying.

I would like to ask the speakers or anyone else, “Describe how you relate, speak or converse, with another, as the truth of who you say you are, as non conceptual awareness?” I am making the assumption that there are others, and not just figments of the imagination of the ‘one’, because you do appear to be speaking to others.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11932 gilbert Mon, 08 Feb 2010 03:06:14 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11932 'I' and 'you' are one and the same. There is no separation. Silence is silence. Sound is sound. They are ONE. Hearing is a direct line to our true essence. Seeing is a direct line to our true essence. Knowing is our true essence. ‘I’ and ‘you’ are one and the same.
There is no separation.
Silence is silence. Sound is sound. They are ONE.
Hearing is a direct line to our true essence.
Seeing is a direct line to our true essence.
Knowing is our true essence.

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]]> By: ghariharan http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11931 ghariharan Mon, 08 Feb 2010 01:55:03 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11931 "I" feel for "you", Gilbert. Maybe, silence is indicated for sometime. “I” feel for “you”, Gilbert. Maybe, silence is indicated for sometime.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11930 gilbert Mon, 08 Feb 2010 00:22:23 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11930 All things, including these impressions registering right now are totally valid. The raw impressions registering are translated by the mind, in so many ways that are impossible to describe or even think about, let alone understand. The 'appearance' of the world is automatically 'happening' before the 'I' is conceived. This 'state of affairs' remains unaltered whether the 'I' concept appears or not. All the drama of life 'appears' and disappears. All the history books are nothing but 'ink on paper', digits in a 'memory chip'. Me-mory (memory) is a trace of 'something', a movement upon emptiness. The emptiness remains untouched and it is the emptiness that is cognizing. The inner battle over true identity is unnecessary. That news is of no use to anyone. How did you forget what you truly are? Re-member-ing what you are is simply (a) recognition. It is re-cognized ONLY because it has already been cognized. You are the cognition and nothing but that. There is ONLY ONE. You ARE THAT. <em> (It appears that the basics were pointed out to me by Bob Adamson over a decade ago. Something began to reverberate in being - a resonance - like the faint voice of a solo singer in an empty vacant cathedral. Some moisture appeared in a parched landscape and life began to sprout again. Shoots appeared here and there. Before long a field of tall grass gently billowing in the breeze. Flowers appeared of every color. The inner search faded away in the dawn, the dawn of my own being. This natural 'self-aware-ness', a 'self-confirming' resonance (life) resounded (still resounds) throughout my entire being. A wish to share this came spontaneously. Sadness came later because of the impossibility to share it and the harsh rejection of almost everyone. The odds seemingly stacked in favor of ignorance - still the expressions flow like wine at a wedding. Even though it appears that 'I', at times, shake the 'living-dead' in order to wake them up, it is of no use. Still one or two, now and then show some life and a response. Whatever appears to take place - nothing is actually happening. Stillness remains as stillness, the true essence remains untouched by the dramas of the world.)</em> All things, including these impressions registering right now are totally valid.
The raw impressions registering are translated by the mind, in so many ways that are impossible to describe or even think about, let alone understand.
The ‘appearance’ of the world is automatically ‘happening’ before the ‘I’ is conceived.
This ‘state of affairs’ remains unaltered whether the ‘I’ concept appears or not. All the drama of life ‘appears’ and disappears.
All the history books are nothing but ‘ink on paper’, digits in a ‘memory chip’.
Me-mory (memory) is a trace of ‘something’, a movement upon emptiness.
The emptiness remains untouched and it is the emptiness that is cognizing.

The inner battle over true identity is unnecessary.
That news is of no use to anyone.
How did you forget what you truly are?
Re-member-ing what you are is simply (a) recognition.
It is re-cognized ONLY because it has already been cognized.
You are the cognition and nothing but that.

There is ONLY ONE.

You ARE THAT.

(It appears that the basics were pointed out to me by Bob Adamson over a decade ago.
Something began to reverberate in being – a resonance – like the faint voice of a solo singer in an empty vacant cathedral. Some moisture appeared in a parched landscape and life began to sprout again. Shoots appeared here and there. Before long a field of tall grass gently billowing in the breeze. Flowers appeared of every color. The inner search faded away in the dawn, the dawn of my own being.
This natural ‘self-aware-ness’, a ‘self-confirming’ resonance (life) resounded (still resounds) throughout my entire being. A wish to share this came spontaneously. Sadness came later because of the impossibility to share it and the harsh rejection of almost everyone. The odds seemingly stacked in favor of ignorance – still the expressions flow like wine at a wedding.
Even though it appears that ‘I’, at times, shake the ‘living-dead’ in order to wake them up, it is of no use. Still one or two, now and then show some life and a response. Whatever appears to take place – nothing is actually happening.
Stillness remains as stillness, the true essence remains untouched by the dramas of the world.)

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]]> By: jenne http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11929 jenne Sun, 07 Feb 2010 22:26:09 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11929 Thank you Randall! i am not sure of what you mean by That “I”-concept is the product of a false division – multiple layers of false assumption need to be solidified before that “I” can be arrived at. Thank you Randall!
i am not sure of what you mean by

That “I”-concept is the product of a false division – multiple layers of false assumption need to be solidified before that “I” can be arrived at.

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]]> By: Randall Friend http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11928 Randall Friend Sun, 07 Feb 2010 22:17:51 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11928 Honest investigation rules out all concepts. All. Even the clearest pointers are concepts, using words to point to that nondual reality which cannot ever be defined in words. "How do I know that I am awareness?" This question is tied up with concept and assumption - are you apart FROM awareness? Can you arrive AT awareness? Do you need to search for awareness? That "I"-concept is the product of a false division - multiple layers of false assumption need to be solidified before that "I" can be arrived at. Yet there is a consistent glossing over of this. This is about nonduality - not-two. If there is not-two, then there is not even the first split or separation. Nonduality isn't a product - it isn't a goal that is finally reached after years of seeking. It isn't a state that an individual reaches. Nonduality means there IS no separation. The individual doesn't arrive at non-separation. The world of "things" isn't magically pulled together, glued as one with some spiritual superglue. Right here and now - THIS is nondual reality. Whatever may seem to appear never divides this present "oneness". Separation is a false assumption. See if there is division or separation before then asking about the results of separation, like "how do I realize"? See if there is someone in existence, some separate entity in existence, before asking about how that entity realizes. See if that entity is actual or conceptual, belief, imagination. Once investigated, that individual is known to be only an arising belief or thought. Then WHO remains to realize anything? Who remains to reach a special state? WHO remains to ask a question? Honest investigation rules out all concepts. All. Even the clearest pointers are concepts, using words to point to that nondual reality which cannot ever be defined in words.

“How do I know that I am awareness?” This question is tied up with concept and assumption – are you apart FROM awareness? Can you arrive AT awareness? Do you need to search for awareness?

That “I”-concept is the product of a false division – multiple layers of false assumption need to be solidified before that “I” can be arrived at. Yet there is a consistent glossing over of this.

This is about nonduality – not-two. If there is not-two, then there is not even the first split or separation. Nonduality isn’t a product – it isn’t a goal that is finally reached after years of seeking. It isn’t a state that an individual reaches.

Nonduality means there IS no separation. The individual doesn’t arrive at non-separation. The world of “things” isn’t magically pulled together, glued as one with some spiritual superglue.

Right here and now – THIS is nondual reality. Whatever may seem to appear never divides this present “oneness”. Separation is a false assumption. See if there is division or separation before then asking about the results of separation, like “how do I realize”?

See if there is someone in existence, some separate entity in existence, before asking about how that entity realizes. See if that entity is actual or conceptual, belief, imagination. Once investigated, that individual is known to be only an arising belief or thought. Then WHO remains to realize anything? Who remains to reach a special state? WHO remains to ask a question?

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]]> By: jenne http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11927 jenne Sun, 07 Feb 2010 22:01:19 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11927 what is the difference between awareness and consciousness? I thought they were one? haha im laughing as i write this but not sure why! what is the difference between awareness and consciousness? I thought they were one?
haha im laughing as i write this but not sure why!

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]]> By: jenne http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11926 jenne Sun, 07 Feb 2010 21:59:11 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11926 thank you mark! so this means all the "teachers" never "got it" either? I thought that somehow the mind rests in its origin or whatever you want to call it. What about the re-cognizing that bob talks about? thank you mark!
so this means all the “teachers” never “got it” either? I thought that somehow the mind rests in its origin or whatever you want to call it. What about the re-cognizing that bob talks about?

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11925 gilbert Sun, 07 Feb 2010 20:47:11 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11925 Some great comments happening. Some very good pointing in fact. Keep it up and I can retire. Whoopie. Some great comments happening. Some very good pointing in fact.
Keep it up and I can retire. Whoopie.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11924 gilbert Sun, 07 Feb 2010 20:45:15 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11924 "Consciousness is all there is"- that is a correction to the quote above. “Consciousness is all there is”- that is a correction to the quote above.

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]]> By: Scarfox http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11923 Scarfox Sun, 07 Feb 2010 20:01:42 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11923 This isn't a competition, there are no buts. Playing with others concepts now are ya? Pure seeing will detonate and then destroy the whole me-thought-construction site. This isn’t a competition, there are no buts. Playing with others concepts now are ya? Pure seeing will detonate and then destroy the whole me-thought-construction site.

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]]> By: Cheryl http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11922 Cheryl Sun, 07 Feb 2010 17:15:25 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11922 Uninvestigated thoughts and beliefs run the show don't they? They are the 'problem' (not the content of them but a belief in them as the real)because they construct a ME where no such creature exists. The thoughts of ME or of an I that is claiming the thoughts are the only ones that really cause trouble. So thought arises in awareness but there is nobody there to claim them, then there is no problem? Uninvestigated thoughts and beliefs run the show don’t they? They are the ‘problem’ (not the content of them but a belief in them as the real)because they construct a ME where no such creature exists. The thoughts of ME or of an I that is claiming the thoughts are the only ones that really cause trouble. So thought arises in awareness but there is nobody there to claim them, then there is no problem?

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]]> By: fernando http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11921 fernando Sun, 07 Feb 2010 16:27:16 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11921 BUT BUT BUT BUT... So what? Thought is NOT the problem. Thought is of the SAME substance of Awareness. The apparent 'problem' is 'me', but 'me' is another thought, the 'me'-thought. And the 'me'-thought, like any other thought, is of the SAME substance of Awareness too. WHO can drop thoughts? Another thought? The apparent 'sequence' is thought-awareness-thought-awareness-thought-awareness... And thought (even the 'me'-thought) is Awareness AS that thought. Ramesh: "All there is is Awareness. Awareness is all there is." BUT BUT BUT BUT… So what?
Thought is NOT the problem.
Thought is of the SAME substance of Awareness.
The apparent ‘problem’ is ‘me’, but ‘me’ is another thought, the ‘me’-thought. And the ‘me’-thought, like any other thought, is of the SAME substance of Awareness too.
WHO can drop thoughts? Another thought?
The apparent ‘sequence’ is thought-awareness-thought-awareness-thought-awareness… And thought (even the ‘me’-thought) is Awareness AS that thought.

Ramesh: “All there is is Awareness. Awareness is all there is.”

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]]> By: Scarfox http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11920 Scarfox Sun, 07 Feb 2010 16:13:06 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11920 dropping a thought is simple, just by being aware of your own being or by looking at an object other than thought you are dropping a thought. Nothing has to drop away, it will drop away on its own accord through naked seeing. It is nothing fancy it can be done this very instant. Even allowing thoughts to come into the seeing and seeing that is fair game. dropping a thought is simple, just by being aware of your own being or by looking at an object other than thought you are dropping a thought. Nothing has to drop away, it will drop away on its own accord through naked seeing. It is nothing fancy it can be done this very instant. Even allowing thoughts to come into the seeing and seeing that is fair game.

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]]> By: Cheryl http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11919 Cheryl Sun, 07 Feb 2010 15:29:18 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11919 When it's said drop thought again and again is it just the conceptual labeling of thought that is being dropped? It's the concepts and beliefs really that have to drop away to reveal pure knowing. Does unconscious thought play any part in this or is that just another concept? When it’s said drop thought again and again is it just the conceptual labeling of thought that is being dropped? It’s the concepts and beliefs really that have to drop away to reveal pure knowing. Does unconscious thought play any part in this or is that just another concept?

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]]> By: Scarfox http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11918 Scarfox Sun, 07 Feb 2010 08:02:44 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11918 Don't try to alter a thought - just be the seeing, taste it over and over. Drop the thought that you are doing that, if possible. It is possible. A thought comes and goes you remain. Does a cloud cause night time? no, and even if it did you're still awake at 8 pm. Anyway, it is actually that easy, since you already are that. You ask, who is there to not alter thoughts? There is only the seeing, so the seeing kind of moves from believing it is the seen, and then is all encompassing. Nothing really moves. Don’t try to alter a thought – just be the seeing, taste it over and over. Drop the thought that you are doing that, if possible. It is possible. A thought comes and goes you remain. Does a cloud cause night time? no, and even if it did you’re still awake at 8 pm. Anyway, it is actually that easy, since you already are that.

You ask, who is there to not alter thoughts? There is only the seeing, so the seeing kind of moves from believing it is the seen, and then is all encompassing. Nothing really moves.

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]]> By: tomasz vanderspeed http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11916 tomasz vanderspeed Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:39:11 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11916 Hey M.Sayers, your Hammer-remark reminded me of something J.D. Salinger wrote: "But I'll tell you a terrible secret — Are you listening to me? There isn't anyone out there who isn't Seymour's Fat Lady. That includes your Professor Tupper, buddy. And all his goddam cousins by the dozens. There isn't anyone anywhere that isn't Seymour's Fat Lady. Don't you know that? Don't you know that goddam secret yet? And don't you know — listen to me, now — don't you know who that Fat Lady really is? . . . Ah, buddy. Ah, buddy. It's Christ Himself. Christ Himself, buddy." -J.D. Salinger Don't believe, and It's as simple as THAT;It's All THAT: "How in hell are you going to recognize a legitimate holy man when you see one if you don't even know a cup of consecrated chicken soup when it's right in front of your nose? " -J.D Salinger I loved the podcast and randall's comments are truly THAT appearing in this immediacy as beautifull gems, thx! Just SEE/read them unaltered, unmodified, not for a ME or You ;-) Hey M.Sayers, your Hammer-remark reminded me of something J.D. Salinger wrote:
“But I’ll tell you a terrible secret — Are you listening to me? There isn’t anyone out there who isn’t Seymour’s Fat Lady. That includes your Professor Tupper, buddy. And all his goddam cousins by the dozens. There isn’t anyone anywhere that isn’t Seymour’s Fat Lady. Don’t you know that? Don’t you know that goddam secret yet? And don’t you know — listen to me, now — don’t you know who that Fat Lady really is? . . . Ah, buddy. Ah, buddy. It’s Christ Himself. Christ Himself, buddy.” -J.D. Salinger

Don’t believe, and It’s as simple as THAT;It’s All THAT:

“How in hell are you going to recognize a legitimate holy man when you see one if you don’t even know a cup of consecrated chicken soup when it’s right in front of your nose? ” -J.D Salinger

I loved the podcast and randall’s comments are truly THAT appearing in this immediacy as beautifull gems, thx! Just SEE/read them unaltered, unmodified, not for a ME or You ;-)

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]]> By: mark http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11915 mark Sat, 06 Feb 2010 19:26:10 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11915 Seeing-knowing-itching-scratching. Not itching not scratching. Being. Its all very well. (Enter mind).. BUT. Thats the little word that mind loves So much.. BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT .. but what? What is it that mind wants? Mind wants clarity. Mind wants answers. Mind wants Truth. Yes, mind wants Truth. And what is it that mind cant have? Mind cant have paradox. Sure mind can explain paradox. But mind has to come down on one side. It has to. It can pretend to be non dual. But it cannot be. And so. And so. That can only point to the release of struggle. Forget it. YOU (mind) will never get it. Ever. Relax. Its always thus. Phew.. Seeing-knowing-itching-scratching. Not itching not scratching. Being. Its all very well. (Enter mind).. BUT. Thats the little word that mind loves So much.. BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT .. but what? What is it that mind wants? Mind wants clarity. Mind wants answers. Mind wants Truth. Yes, mind wants Truth. And what is it that mind cant have? Mind cant have paradox. Sure mind can explain paradox. But mind has to come down on one side. It has to. It can pretend to be non dual. But it cannot be. And so. And so. That can only point to the release of struggle. Forget it. YOU (mind) will never get it. Ever. Relax. Its always thus. Phew..

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]]> By: fernando http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11912 fernando Sat, 06 Feb 2010 13:49:13 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11912 Seeing-Knowing-Awareness is ‘un-turnoffable’. It always IS. It appears as ALL things, ONE singular happening. NO separation anywhere. I am THAT. Seeing-Knowing-Awareness is ‘un-turnoffable’.
It always IS.
It appears as ALL things, ONE singular happening.
NO separation anywhere.
I am THAT.

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]]> By: Ronna http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11911 Ronna Fri, 05 Feb 2010 20:46:37 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11911 Yes, it is amazing the amount of money that probably gets spent on guru retreats, books, memberships, dues etc. etc.! What is shown here will assist anyone in investigating what they really are and this is priceless!!!! Thank you so much for providing this free of charge, always available. As usual, I think this is the best one so far!!! Yes, it is amazing the amount of money that probably gets spent on guru retreats, books, memberships, dues etc. etc.! What is shown here will assist anyone in investigating what they really are and this is priceless!!!! Thank you so much for providing this free of charge, always available. As usual, I think this is the best one so far!!!

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11910 gilbert Fri, 05 Feb 2010 20:46:08 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11910 When the expression gets very close to 'reality' the 'seekers' move away in droves because they already sense that they will be robbed of all their beliefs if they stay with this raw 'news' being expressed. Other unpopular pieces of information appear on my website - seeing-knowing dot com. You will notice that there are only a few on line at that site at any time. The websites that propagate spiritual bullshit have hundreds, if not thousands viewing at any time and they love it, because it supports the belief in a 'me'. It is that crap that keeps the seeker <strong>on a path</strong>, a path that does not exist except in the mind. Who wants to know that? When the expression gets very close to ‘reality’ the ‘seekers’ move away in droves because they already sense that they will be robbed of all their beliefs if they stay with this raw ‘news’ being expressed.
Other unpopular pieces of information appear on my website – seeing-knowing dot com. You will notice that there are only a few on line at that site at any time. The websites that propagate spiritual bullshit have hundreds, if not thousands viewing at any time and they love it, because it supports the belief in a ‘me’. It is that crap that keeps the seeker on a path, a path that does not exist except in the mind.
Who wants to know that?

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11909 gilbert Fri, 05 Feb 2010 20:41:54 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11909 Pure intelligence. Pure energy. The activity of knowing is not a ‘thing’. There is no entity doing anything. Seeing is happening. Be that and let THAT eliminate the erroneous beliefs. There is no entity doing anything - Not any-where nor at any-time. Place and time appear as ‘impressions’ which gives the appearance of apparent <em>linear existence</em>. For whom? Obviously <strong>that</strong> which knows <em>space and time</em> must be beyond space and time. What form could such knowing have? It appears AS a body (the universal body - no separation) Could it be a separate body? No, a body with a bounday is an impression of some activity, energy appearing as a body. A mind? Can you find a mind without thinking. Mind is thought, mind is 'me'. What is suggested is: Investigate the believed in entity. The simplicity of this ‘investigation’ (which some teachers vehemently oppose) is not a ‘doing’. The apparent liberating ‘result’ of the investigation reveals the only true identity – One without a second. Whatever label is put upon it, it is merely a label. Grasping consciousness can never encompass its own source. Naked Knowing does not need any labels. The entire realms of Objective Knowledge and Subjective Knowledge can be stripped down to ‘impressions’ registering in the immediacy. Therefore EVERYTHING is THAT. ‘You’ as a seeming separate ‘entity’ will NEVER know what is being pointed at. What you truly ARE, already knows and the search never really started. What mind is there? If you don’t think about it. What mind is there? - If you don’t think about it. Pure intelligence. Pure energy.
The activity of knowing is not a ‘thing’.
There is no entity doing anything. Seeing is happening. Be that and let THAT eliminate the erroneous beliefs.
There is no entity doing anything – Not any-where nor at any-time.
Place and time appear as ‘impressions’ which gives the appearance of apparent linear existence.

For whom?

Obviously that which knows space and time must be beyond space and time.
What form could such knowing have? It appears AS a body (the universal body – no separation)
Could it be a separate body? No, a body with a bounday is an impression of some activity, energy appearing as a body.

A mind? Can you find a mind without thinking. Mind is thought, mind is ‘me’.

What is suggested is: Investigate the believed in entity.

The simplicity of this ‘investigation’ (which some teachers vehemently oppose) is not a ‘doing’.
The apparent liberating ‘result’ of the investigation reveals the only true identity – One without a second.
Whatever label is put upon it, it is merely a label. Grasping consciousness can never encompass its own source.
Naked Knowing does not need any labels.
The entire realms of Objective Knowledge and Subjective Knowledge can be stripped down to ‘impressions’ registering in the immediacy.
Therefore EVERYTHING is THAT.

‘You’ as a seeming separate ‘entity’ will NEVER know what is being pointed at.
What you truly ARE, already knows and the search never really started.
What mind is there? If you don’t think about it.

What mind is there? – If you don’t think about it.

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]]> By: Cheryl http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11908 Cheryl Fri, 05 Feb 2010 20:03:20 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11908 It's said "what you seek you already are". So what are 'you'? You are 'something' that exists and cannot be negated, prior to mind coming in labeling it, so how can it be no thing? Is what you are very simply just a knowing that is recognized, like it will be known when it is seen? As the pointers suggest there is no one seeing it, it just registers in awareness. What is the sense when the knowing is happening? I've been listening alot on the ipod but attempting not to grasp onto the pointers as such more trying to see beyond them at what they are pointing at...who is doing this?? Without concepts there really is no way to describe it...is the knowing just whatever arises in the appearance without grasping - it just is and that's it? Simple! It’s said “what you seek you already are”. So what are ‘you’? You are ‘something’ that exists and cannot be negated, prior to mind coming in labeling it, so how can it be no thing? Is what you are very simply just a knowing that is recognized, like it will be known when it is seen? As the pointers suggest there is no one seeing it, it just registers in awareness. What is the sense when the knowing is happening? I’ve been listening alot on the ipod but attempting not to grasp onto the pointers as such more trying to see beyond them at what they are pointing at…who is doing this?? Without concepts there really is no way to describe it…is the knowing just whatever arises in the appearance without grasping – it just is and that’s it? Simple!

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]]> By: tamino http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11907 tamino Fri, 05 Feb 2010 07:25:27 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11907 Just wanted to let you know how grateful I am for this site. Something resonating sometimes, so I keep coming back. Still a seeker, sure, cannot be anything else it seems right now. Wanted to let you know my appreciation. Just wanted to let you know how grateful I am for this site. Something resonating sometimes, so I keep coming back. Still a seeker, sure, cannot be anything else it seems right now.
Wanted to let you know my appreciation.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11906 gilbert Fri, 05 Feb 2010 04:11:44 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11906 Thank you Ronna. We appreciate it. There are costs involved with running this site and it is only fair that those who benefit 'should' give something back (even if only a comment or two or an opinion - that is my opinion). It takes many hours to pull a program together and make it a fairly pro job. We will continue for the moment. You would be surprised at how few donate, given the fact that there are a thousand plus regular listeners. As it is no one is excluded and that suits our policy. Warm regards - Gilbert. Thank you Ronna. We appreciate it. There are costs involved with running this site and it is only fair that those who benefit ‘should’ give something back (even if only a comment or two or an opinion – that is my opinion). It takes many hours to pull a program together and make it a fairly pro job. We will continue for the moment. You would be surprised at how few donate, given the fact that there are a thousand plus regular listeners. As it is no one is excluded and that suits our policy.
Warm regards – Gilbert.

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]]> By: fernando http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11905 fernando Fri, 05 Feb 2010 03:46:13 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11905 There is only ONE happening. Whatever is happening, it’s not divided. It has no ‘parts’. How could be? There is nothing outside this ONE happening! There is only ONE happening.
Whatever is happening, it’s not divided. It has no ‘parts’.
How could be?
There is nothing outside this ONE happening!

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]]> By: Randall Friend http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11904 Randall Friend Fri, 05 Feb 2010 01:36:42 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11904 Who are these "persons" or individuals you speak of? How many layers of assumption or imagination does it take to arrive at a "person"? The primary split is subject-object - is reality divided in this way? How do you know? What evidence is there? Take a look at present reality - it's just this singular "happening" - this totality which has no beginning and no ending. Taking yourself to be a person, a limited individual, is the only bondage. And the substance of that bondage is only imagination, which has no actual substance at all. If questioned, it dissolves easily. If held onto, all sorts of problems arise. If we're wanting out of it, we can continue to ignore the direct pointers and suggestions, or earnestly investigate reality, honestly question every assumption, no matter how near and dear. Question everything - including the fact of your own existence. You'll find that your existence is the only thing that can remain standing, while the world, body and mind dissolve like a cloud passing through the sky. Who are these “persons” or individuals you speak of? How many layers of assumption or imagination does it take to arrive at a “person”?

The primary split is subject-object – is reality divided in this way? How do you know? What evidence is there? Take a look at present reality – it’s just this singular “happening” – this totality which has no beginning and no ending.

Taking yourself to be a person, a limited individual, is the only bondage. And the substance of that bondage is only imagination, which has no actual substance at all. If questioned, it dissolves easily. If held onto, all sorts of problems arise.

If we’re wanting out of it, we can continue to ignore the direct pointers and suggestions, or earnestly investigate reality, honestly question every assumption, no matter how near and dear. Question everything – including the fact of your own existence. You’ll find that your existence is the only thing that can remain standing, while the world, body and mind dissolve like a cloud passing through the sky.

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]]> By: mark http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11903 mark Thu, 04 Feb 2010 22:13:58 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11903 There is sensation of looking forward to these podcasts.. But what the hell! It sure beats reality TV. There is sensation of looking forward to these podcasts.. But what the hell! It sure beats reality TV.

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]]> By: Ronna http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11902 Ronna Thu, 04 Feb 2010 19:28:42 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11902 What a great podcast! The music choices are so great as well as the sound quality. Hearing Randall is always very clear!! Donation is on the way!!! Thanks again for all you do it is much appreciated. What a great podcast! The music choices are so great as well as the sound quality. Hearing Randall is always very clear!! Donation is on the way!!! Thanks again for all you do it is much appreciated.

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]]> By: msayers http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11901 msayers Thu, 04 Feb 2010 19:22:09 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11901 I "see" you everywhere I look, Hammer! Don't know what prompted this comment, but boy did I need that! Certainly, I don't want to believe it's as simple as all that, but I'm almost worn out now, so that appears to be the only option left. You're beating me down, man... thanks! And thanks again, Gilbert, for your help early on. Probably don't even remember me, but I bugged you enough. Gave up b/c I was afraid of bothering you too much. This service you provide has been a decent enough substitute to the old email conversations, and for that I'm exceedingly grateful. Oh, and Bob too, even though we've never met. ;) I “see” you everywhere I look, Hammer! Don’t know what prompted this comment, but boy did I need that! Certainly, I don’t want to believe it’s as simple as all that, but I’m almost worn out now, so that appears to be the only option left. You’re beating me down, man… thanks!

And thanks again, Gilbert, for your help early on. Probably don’t even remember me, but I bugged you enough. Gave up b/c I was afraid of bothering you too much. This service you provide has been a decent enough substitute to the old email conversations, and for that I’m exceedingly grateful. Oh, and Bob too, even though we’ve never met. ;)

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]]> By: Jan Madsen http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11898 Jan Madsen Thu, 04 Feb 2010 17:39:55 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11898 "ignore the opinions of others. Let the rumors of your foolishness spread far and wide. None of it matters in the least. Busy yourself with the burning of all the furniture in the house of the mind. When the job is finished, dynamite the foundations and bulldoze the lot." Guin Miller Songs To Live By “ignore the opinions of others.
Let the rumors of your foolishness spread far and wide.
None of it matters in the least.
Busy yourself with the burning of all the furniture
in the house of the mind.
When the job is finished, dynamite the foundations
and bulldoze the lot.”
Guin Miller
Songs To Live By

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]]> By: Sara http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11897 Sara Thu, 04 Feb 2010 13:23:41 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11897 Words are the tools we have to communicate about this, but at the same time they seem to blur our understanding, since words carry slightly different meanings to different indiviuals. As the words you mention "knowing" and "appearance" will do. Different "gurus" settle for favourite expressions, e.g. Ramesh Balsekar often talking about "You are not the doer" which can be very easy or very difficult to understand. I think that often when two persons discussing this issue of the absolute that we are don't seem to agree, I believe that they could very well know the same un-knowable but get stuck on the words. Words are the tools we have to communicate about this, but at the same time they seem to blur our understanding, since words carry slightly different meanings to different indiviuals. As the words you mention “knowing” and “appearance” will do. Different “gurus” settle for favourite expressions, e.g. Ramesh Balsekar often talking about “You are not the doer” which can be very easy or very difficult to understand.

I think that often when two persons discussing this issue of the absolute that we are don’t seem to agree, I believe that they could very well know the same un-knowable but get stuck on the words.

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11896 gilbert Thu, 04 Feb 2010 11:00:31 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11896 Charles Darwin: "As soon as the important faculties of imagination, wonder and curiosity, together with some power of reasoning had become partially developed, man would naturally crave to understand what was passing around him and would have vaguely speculated on his own existence." Remove the suggestion of 'past time' from his description and watch the immediacy of how the mind functions. Just a suggestion. Charles Darwin: “As soon as the important faculties of imagination, wonder and curiosity, together with some power of reasoning had become partially developed, man would naturally crave to understand what was passing around him and would have vaguely speculated on his own existence.”

Remove the suggestion of ‘past time’ from his description and watch the immediacy of how the mind functions.
Just a suggestion.

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]]> By: fernando http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11895 fernando Thu, 04 Feb 2010 01:35:37 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11895 ... It's like the mirror and the image in the mirror. You can't separate them. They are one. The image in the mirror (ONE image) can't 'hurt' the mirror. … It’s like the mirror and the image in the mirror. You can’t separate them. They are one.
The image in the mirror (ONE image) can’t ‘hurt’ the mirror.

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]]> By: Randall Friend http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11894 Randall Friend Thu, 04 Feb 2010 00:14:13 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11894 Trying to "find" what you are is still a subtle insistence on the "seeker" - the entity who exists, who stands apart, that limited being you've taken yourself to be. Instead of continuing to imagine yourself as this or that, just notice what is the present reality. The only stable and consistent aspect of experience is that presence or activity of knowing. It is literally blindingly obvious and unavoidable. It doesn't require a search - it is inescapable. To seek it requires a bundle of imagination, and that bundle effectively "leads away" from that presence, into more and more imagination, solidifying imagination instead of taking a jackhammer to it. To seek it requires that presence to be overlooked again and again, the direct pointers to be discarded again and again, the invitation to investigate the reality of this "person" to be ignored again and again. Yet that presence is the very light which illuminates the search, as it goes off the rails over and over. That presence is self-shining, self-evident, clearly and obviously here as the idea of "me" parades around in spiritual shoes. That presence is what you are - not the parading, not the thoughts, not the sensations we imagine as "body". Knowing what you are doesn't require a single step, a single thought, a book, a guru, or a practice. You cannot BECOME something through spiritual seeking. You simply notice that you already ARE that. If these words are appearing, that presence is there. There is nowhere else to look, nothing else to know. That presence or activity of knowing is what you are. It is the totality itself, the one essence expressing as everything, as appearance itself. The knowing and the appearance are absolutely inseparable. To even say "knowing" and "appearance" - the mind automatically imagines them as divided. Trying to “find” what you are is still a subtle insistence on the “seeker” – the entity who exists, who stands apart, that limited being you’ve taken yourself to be.

Instead of continuing to imagine yourself as this or that, just notice what is the present reality. The only stable and consistent aspect of experience is that presence or activity of knowing. It is literally blindingly obvious and unavoidable. It doesn’t require a search – it is inescapable. To seek it requires a bundle of imagination, and that bundle effectively “leads away” from that presence, into more and more imagination, solidifying imagination instead of taking a jackhammer to it. To seek it requires that presence to be overlooked again and again, the direct pointers to be discarded again and again, the invitation to investigate the reality of this “person” to be ignored again and again.

Yet that presence is the very light which illuminates the search, as it goes off the rails over and over. That presence is self-shining, self-evident, clearly and obviously here as the idea of “me” parades around in spiritual shoes. That presence is what you are – not the parading, not the thoughts, not the sensations we imagine as “body”.

Knowing what you are doesn’t require a single step, a single thought, a book, a guru, or a practice. You cannot BECOME something through spiritual seeking. You simply notice that you already ARE that.

If these words are appearing, that presence is there. There is nowhere else to look, nothing else to know. That presence or activity of knowing is what you are. It is the totality itself, the one essence expressing as everything, as appearance itself. The knowing and the appearance are absolutely inseparable. To even say “knowing” and “appearance” – the mind automatically imagines them as divided.

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]]> By: daniel http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11893 daniel Wed, 03 Feb 2010 19:20:37 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11893 Thank you so very much for your marvelous programs. We love UGC!!! Ewa and Daniel in Sweden Thank you so very much for your marvelous programs. We love UGC!!!
Ewa and Daniel in Sweden

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]]> By: msayers http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11892 msayers Wed, 03 Feb 2010 14:54:25 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11892 Wow! A "greatest hits" album! Fantastic! Love these, Gilbert and Areti. Thanks a ton! Mike Wow! A “greatest hits” album! Fantastic! Love these, Gilbert and Areti. Thanks a ton!

Mike

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]]> By: gilbert http://urbangurucafe.com/2010/02/03/70-the-crux-of-the-matter/#comment-11891 gilbert Wed, 03 Feb 2010 14:02:21 +0000 http://urbangurucafe.com/?p=677#comment-11891 We revisit short extracts from the first few programs we made. It is bound to hammer home the message. Warm regards - Gilbert We revisit short extracts from the first few programs we made. It is bound to hammer home the message. Warm regards – Gilbert

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